Ground vehicles are ass and shit get killed by 1 maaws (if u dnt have a warrior or tusk) or by Heli lock ons , and are quick disabled, i still dont get the sense why i should pay over 8k for a useless ground vehicle that can be killed anytime, maybe if the prices are halfed once again more people would fight on the ground, but why should i buy 5k LAV when i can buy 2k Venom and easily win most of the time.
The problem is u HAVE TO shot them out of the Venom and that doesn't work all the time.
If you just engine him he glides above u, shooting at you minimum disabling your turret, then crashlands and he only has to repair the engine, while the LAV user has to fix EVERYTHING that got damaged (it has 8 Wheels
) to enable his gun again.
Ground Vehicles imo should get a possibility to repair all wheels/tracks with 1 Animation. That would fix alot of problems.
If you just engine him he glides above u, shooting at you minimum disabling your turret, then crashlands and he only has to repair the engine, while the LAV user has to fix EVERYTHING that got damaged (it has 8 Wheels
) to enable his gun again.Ground Vehicles imo should get a possibility to repair all wheels/tracks with 1 Animation. That would fix alot of problems.
Likes:
Whocares
i remember suggesting some kind of repair kit for balanced amount of money
Likes:
Kuke and [COBRA] Lumpi
Repair kits, and damage adjustments or armor adjustments should be worked in, I don't think an entire price change is the answer, because people still buy ground vehicles, and if you make ground vehicles that cheap, all people are gonna use is ground vehicles, and you won't see a heli in the sky I think, and that would make Arma quite boring
this is what i send Miss a while ago, she declined all of it
M134 Heli Meta Change:
i have some balancing changes that can be changed quite easily which should have a huge balancing change on the server.
main point of it is the M134 meta that has been existing in the game forever, and has been existing on the server, since ever.
here are some examples why M134 is so strong:
- you can disable every turret of any vehicle with it, possibly in an instant with 4k rpm (with the exceptions of some very high armor vehicles like tanks)
- you can kill any vehicle with it.
- even the strongest vehicles that cost double, triple or more of its price can get killed by M134 Helis quite easily.
- ground vehicles can be capped in their ability to look upwards, which results in the Pilots to hover above the vehicle so he cant be reached.
- the ability to move around the map very fast.
- even when you manage to engine a M134 heli, the pilot will in many cases be able to crashland the helicopter, out of sight for a ground vehicle to reach it, or another heli needs to hover above it to shoot the pilot out.
which can give the pilot multiple chances to crashland, repair the engine and fight again.
- M134 Helis can shoot down on a target, from above, but the one getting shot at can only see the bottom hull of the Helicopter, not the gunner. the hull cant get penetrated by normal guns, only by specific very high
calibre guns, like the often used LAV Gun.
the balancing "solution" of this problem is to remove the Venom, so the only left M134 Helicopters are:
- Blackhawk (has manual fire, capable as venom, easier to engine as venom)
- Chinook (also cheap for its possible outcome, fast, has flares, easy to engine, )
- Littlebird (cheap, needs to be stationary in very most scenarios, easy to engine)
all of this Helicopters can be damaged by HE Bullets, in a way that can also kill the Helicopter after enough hits connected, the venom tanks alot of HE shots.
this change will ship the chances, and the meta to more ground vehicles being used, since then vehicles like the BMP and the BTR90 for example, can shoot HE shots on their target,
which right now with the Venom meta are pretty useless, because the Venom tanks the HE shots well, and the hull cant be penetrated by its Gun.
Why exactly is the Venom too strong?
- the gun itself is as already mentioned, obviously overpowered
- the engine is too small, too hard to engine, tanks too much
- tanks too many HE shots to be influenced by it
- vehicles that cost double or triple its price cant penetrate the hull of it.
- shooting someone out of it is really hard. the gun itself blocks bullets, the cockpit bars block bullets aswell.
- even when you manage to engine it, the pilot can be able to crashland the helicopter, out of sight for a ground vehicle to reach it, or another heli needs to hover above it to shoot the pilot out.
it can give the pilot multiple chances to crashland, repair the engine and fight again.
- it moves fast around the map.
- All that reasons make it pretty much a agile capable tank in the air, and it destroys the balance of the server.
A Suggestion for Heli Price Changes:
- adjust blackhawk price to 16 bc bandit, it is 14 bc rn.
- adjust chinook price to 11 bc bandit, it is 7 or 8 rn. store price is 5 Gold atm, it should be 1 Briefcase, so players cant sell their Backpack, PKM etc. and store/rearm at every safezone. Timer should be 15 minutes.
Chukar Rule / Price Revert:
disallow chukars to attack ground vehicles:
- Chukar can reach speeds up to 350 km/h +
- it is very tiny, hitting it in time, before impact, is rarely possible.
- there are more then enough ways to counter vehicles without a suicide drone:
Maaws is available on Berezino outpost and Hippie every restart for every player to get, Javelin,
other ground vehicles, Helis, Rocket Helis, Lock on from Attack Heli.
- a 20 briefcase suicide drone being able to destroy vehicles up to 110 briefcase, quite easily, is not good balancing.
- if you would change this,
you can revert the price to 20 bc, because right now with the chukar change to 30 briefcase you nerfed one of the best possibilities to counter attack helis.
because the Main Problem is that Chukars destroy ground vehicles up to 6 times of its price, and the ground vehicle has barely a chance to defend itself.
Viper remove:
i suggest that the AH-1Z Viper gets removed as it has too many advantages to get countered:
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) countering with a chukar becomes a unavailable possiblity
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) Helis like the Venom, Blackhawk are out of question for a fight against it, since they have no flares.
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) due to having flares the Chinook is the only normal helicopter that can counter it, with the disatvantage of it being extremely big, and heavy,
which makes it very easy to hit for both the pilot and the gunner,
besides the fact that the chinook engine is paper in general, 1-2-3 shots from the gunner will be enough to engine it. exploding it is also too easy/fast with the Viper Gun.
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) the heli is not dependant on AA support from their team, nor are they forced to stay around specific areas, where they could get AA support from.
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) being really powerful, even with flaring there is in experience only a small chance you can survive 2 sidewinders being shot at the same time.
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) countering it with another attack heli can be hard, since if the gunner of the Viper shoots 2 Siderwinders while engaging,
the countering Attack Heli Pilot will have to spam flares and shoot at the same time.
- The Gun is one of the strongest in the Game, capable to even shoot people out of vehicles like the M6 Linebacker, also shredding through Helicopters really well, exploding them fast,
while other helicopters either dont have a gun as strong (Mi24) or are limited in regard of Firerate (Apache)
- Sidewinders can be rearmed, so it will never run out of Anti Air, Anti Air that would be expensive to shoot from a Manpad. or a AA Vehicle, which could get tracked down.
The Server would actually need someone to make balancing changes in favor of every type of player, you cant let the playersbase decide on things theyre constantly using, since obviously they will vote against it
M134 Heli Meta Change:
i have some balancing changes that can be changed quite easily which should have a huge balancing change on the server.
main point of it is the M134 meta that has been existing in the game forever, and has been existing on the server, since ever.
here are some examples why M134 is so strong:
- you can disable every turret of any vehicle with it, possibly in an instant with 4k rpm (with the exceptions of some very high armor vehicles like tanks)
- you can kill any vehicle with it.
- even the strongest vehicles that cost double, triple or more of its price can get killed by M134 Helis quite easily.
- ground vehicles can be capped in their ability to look upwards, which results in the Pilots to hover above the vehicle so he cant be reached.
- the ability to move around the map very fast.
- even when you manage to engine a M134 heli, the pilot will in many cases be able to crashland the helicopter, out of sight for a ground vehicle to reach it, or another heli needs to hover above it to shoot the pilot out.
which can give the pilot multiple chances to crashland, repair the engine and fight again.
- M134 Helis can shoot down on a target, from above, but the one getting shot at can only see the bottom hull of the Helicopter, not the gunner. the hull cant get penetrated by normal guns, only by specific very high
calibre guns, like the often used LAV Gun.
the balancing "solution" of this problem is to remove the Venom, so the only left M134 Helicopters are:
- Blackhawk (has manual fire, capable as venom, easier to engine as venom)
- Chinook (also cheap for its possible outcome, fast, has flares, easy to engine, )
- Littlebird (cheap, needs to be stationary in very most scenarios, easy to engine)
all of this Helicopters can be damaged by HE Bullets, in a way that can also kill the Helicopter after enough hits connected, the venom tanks alot of HE shots.
this change will ship the chances, and the meta to more ground vehicles being used, since then vehicles like the BMP and the BTR90 for example, can shoot HE shots on their target,
which right now with the Venom meta are pretty useless, because the Venom tanks the HE shots well, and the hull cant be penetrated by its Gun.
Why exactly is the Venom too strong?
- the gun itself is as already mentioned, obviously overpowered
- the engine is too small, too hard to engine, tanks too much
- tanks too many HE shots to be influenced by it
- vehicles that cost double or triple its price cant penetrate the hull of it.
- shooting someone out of it is really hard. the gun itself blocks bullets, the cockpit bars block bullets aswell.
- even when you manage to engine it, the pilot can be able to crashland the helicopter, out of sight for a ground vehicle to reach it, or another heli needs to hover above it to shoot the pilot out.
it can give the pilot multiple chances to crashland, repair the engine and fight again.
- it moves fast around the map.
- All that reasons make it pretty much a agile capable tank in the air, and it destroys the balance of the server.
A Suggestion for Heli Price Changes:
- adjust blackhawk price to 16 bc bandit, it is 14 bc rn.
- adjust chinook price to 11 bc bandit, it is 7 or 8 rn. store price is 5 Gold atm, it should be 1 Briefcase, so players cant sell their Backpack, PKM etc. and store/rearm at every safezone. Timer should be 15 minutes.
Chukar Rule / Price Revert:
disallow chukars to attack ground vehicles:
- Chukar can reach speeds up to 350 km/h +
- it is very tiny, hitting it in time, before impact, is rarely possible.
- there are more then enough ways to counter vehicles without a suicide drone:
Maaws is available on Berezino outpost and Hippie every restart for every player to get, Javelin,
other ground vehicles, Helis, Rocket Helis, Lock on from Attack Heli.
- a 20 briefcase suicide drone being able to destroy vehicles up to 110 briefcase, quite easily, is not good balancing.
- if you would change this,
you can revert the price to 20 bc, because right now with the chukar change to 30 briefcase you nerfed one of the best possibilities to counter attack helis.
because the Main Problem is that Chukars destroy ground vehicles up to 6 times of its price, and the ground vehicle has barely a chance to defend itself.
Viper remove:
i suggest that the AH-1Z Viper gets removed as it has too many advantages to get countered:
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) countering with a chukar becomes a unavailable possiblity
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) Helis like the Venom, Blackhawk are out of question for a fight against it, since they have no flares.
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) due to having flares the Chinook is the only normal helicopter that can counter it, with the disatvantage of it being extremely big, and heavy,
which makes it very easy to hit for both the pilot and the gunner,
besides the fact that the chinook engine is paper in general, 1-2-3 shots from the gunner will be enough to engine it. exploding it is also too easy/fast with the Viper Gun.
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) the heli is not dependant on AA support from their team, nor are they forced to stay around specific areas, where they could get AA support from.
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) being really powerful, even with flaring there is in experience only a small chance you can survive 2 sidewinders being shot at the same time.
- due to the Sidewinder (Air to Air rockets) countering it with another attack heli can be hard, since if the gunner of the Viper shoots 2 Siderwinders while engaging,
the countering Attack Heli Pilot will have to spam flares and shoot at the same time.
- The Gun is one of the strongest in the Game, capable to even shoot people out of vehicles like the M6 Linebacker, also shredding through Helicopters really well, exploding them fast,
while other helicopters either dont have a gun as strong (Mi24) or are limited in regard of Firerate (Apache)
- Sidewinders can be rearmed, so it will never run out of Anti Air, Anti Air that would be expensive to shoot from a Manpad. or a AA Vehicle, which could get tracked down.
The Server would actually need someone to make balancing changes in favor of every type of player, you cant let the playersbase decide on things theyre constantly using, since obviously they will vote against it
Rethinking Helicopter & Drone Balance in Epoch
Lately the server has been stuck in a cycle where a handful of airframes dictate the entire PvP environment. The M134 platform, especially the Venom, alongside the AH-1Z Viper and the current Chukar rule, create a situation where other vehicles are invalidated. If balance is about variety, counterplay, and fairness, then it’s time to revisit how these assets are handled.
The Problem With the Venom & the M134 Meta
The Venom in particular has warped the meta for years. It functions less like a helicopter and more like an airborne MBT:
The result is a flying tank that erases the viability of BTRs, BMPs, and mid-tier armor that should be meaningful choices.
Proposed Fix: Remove the Venom
Removing the Venom alone would break the current monopoly. Other M134 helis are strong but manageable:
All three are susceptible to HE fire in ways the Venom is not, which would restore value to ground vehicles.
Price & Economy Adjustments
To reinforce balance, heli pricing should reflect their potential:
These tweaks make helicopters a commitment, not an all-purpose tool.
The Chukar Problem
Right now, the Chukar suicide drone has gone from “interesting counter” to “cheap delete button.”
Fix: Prohibit Chukars from targeting ground vehicles. Once that’s in place, their price can revert to 20 BC—restoring them as a fair anti-air option without invalidating armor.
Why the Viper Doesn’t Fit
The AH-1Z Viper is essentially a “balance breaker” helicopter:
It’s not just strong—it invalidates every other heli. Removing it would reopen the skies to diverse strategies.
Closing Thoughts
The Venom, Chukar, and Viper all share one issue: they provide outsized power for their cost and erase counterplay. Removing or adjusting them isn’t about nerfing fun; it’s about restoring variety. When BMPs, BTRs, Blackhawks, and AA vehicles all matter again, the server feels alive, fair, and worth investing time into.
TL;DR:
Balance isn’t about taking toys away—it’s about making sure every toy has a role.
Lately the server has been stuck in a cycle where a handful of airframes dictate the entire PvP environment. The M134 platform, especially the Venom, alongside the AH-1Z Viper and the current Chukar rule, create a situation where other vehicles are invalidated. If balance is about variety, counterplay, and fairness, then it’s time to revisit how these assets are handled.
The Problem With the Venom & the M134 Meta
The Venom in particular has warped the meta for years. It functions less like a helicopter and more like an airborne MBT:
- Sheer Damage Output: 4,000 RPM is enough to disable turrets or shred hulls in seconds. Nothing in its price bracket should delete assets so quickly.
- Durability: HE rounds that should be counters barely scratch it, while more expensive ground vehicles watch their shots disappear into its hull.
- Survivability: Even when “engined,” pilots can crash-land, repair, and re-engage repeatedly, buying multiple extra lives per sortie.
- Angles of Attack: By hovering above targets, it abuses elevation limits, forcing ground armor into helplessness.
- Economic Efficiency: For its cost, it can neutralize vehicles worth double or triple its price.
The result is a flying tank that erases the viability of BTRs, BMPs, and mid-tier armor that should be meaningful choices.
Proposed Fix: Remove the Venom
Removing the Venom alone would break the current monopoly. Other M134 helis are strong but manageable:
- Blackhawk: Still dangerous, but manual fire makes it more skill-based and easier to counter.
- Chinook: Big, obvious, fragile engines; can be balanced with proper pricing.
- Little Bird: Glass cannon—cheap but stationary and vulnerable.
All three are susceptible to HE fire in ways the Venom is not, which would restore value to ground vehicles.
Price & Economy Adjustments
To reinforce balance, heli pricing should reflect their potential:
- Blackhawk: 16 BC (up from 14).
- Chinook: 11 BC (up from 7–8). Store price should be 1 BC instead of 5 Gold, with a 15-minute cooldown to prevent backpack-selling cheese.
These tweaks make helicopters a commitment, not an all-purpose tool.
The Chukar Problem
Right now, the Chukar suicide drone has gone from “interesting counter” to “cheap delete button.”
- At 350 km/h, it’s nearly impossible to stop before impact.
- A 20 BC drone shouldn’t be able to erase 100+ BC vehicles with little counterplay.
- The server already has plenty of anti-vehicle options (MAAWS, Javelin, AT helis, etc.).
Fix: Prohibit Chukars from targeting ground vehicles. Once that’s in place, their price can revert to 20 BC—restoring them as a fair anti-air option without invalidating armor.
Why the Viper Doesn’t Fit
The AH-1Z Viper is essentially a “balance breaker” helicopter:
- Sidewinders: Create complete air dominance, leaving no role for team-based AA support. Even with flares, most pilots won’t survive a double launch.
- Gun Strength: Its cannon shreds through helicopters and even AA vehicles like the Linebacker in seconds.
- Unfair Countering: Venoms and Blackhawks have no flares, making them free kills. Chinooks theoretically compete, but their paper-thin engines and massive hitboxes make them fodder.
- Unlimited AA: Sidewinders are easily rearmed, unlike costly, limited manpads or vehicle AA.
It’s not just strong—it invalidates every other heli. Removing it would reopen the skies to diverse strategies.
Closing Thoughts
The Venom, Chukar, and Viper all share one issue: they provide outsized power for their cost and erase counterplay. Removing or adjusting them isn’t about nerfing fun; it’s about restoring variety. When BMPs, BTRs, Blackhawks, and AA vehicles all matter again, the server feels alive, fair, and worth investing time into.
TL;DR:
- Remove the Venom → restores ground vehicle relevance.
- Adjust Blackhawk/Chinook prices → keeps helis strong but costly.
- Disallow Chukars vs ground vehicles → fair anti-air, no cheap deletes.
- Remove the Viper → too dominant with Sidewinders + gun combo.
Balance isn’t about taking toys away—it’s about making sure every toy has a role.
didnt read all but removing venom will kill this server, somethink needs to be changed for sure but removing is not fun...
lets take this from the other side, 1 lav vs 1 venom? simple skill check decent lav gunner should get this, also lav lose most of the fight because gunners with too high ego go for clip kills from over 1km range giving up position for free that is one of the most important factors in this fight. also fixing lav is sometimes very easy unless venom guy do some good spray over wheels, sometimes you fix few and you are good and you can do it faster than venom crashland fix engine and start again
1lav vs 3 venoms? of course easy venom win
3 lav vs 1 venom? easy lav win
3 vs 3? easy lavs win
lavs win more, also finishing lavs after making it disabled need some times unless lav is alone and you can just manual fire him thats a moment when some air support for lav should show up. it is how it is, just lower all ground vehicles prices a little again ( dont forget about bunker limited trader prices ) and its should be fine
viper? for me its almost same threat as every other rocket heli and best counter for it is another rocket heli and not a fucking chukar misha... and 2 sidewinders doesnt matter unless you are lucky, Me and my gunners dont even risk potential problems of wasting them on helis with flares, even using sidewinders in ch/venom swarm is kinda uselles its take sometimes to much time that can be spend shooting with viper gun. As a pilot i find viper way less interesting than every other rocket heli, shit feels like mi rocket... but yeah its fun for gunners
lets take this from the other side, 1 lav vs 1 venom? simple skill check decent lav gunner should get this, also lav lose most of the fight because gunners with too high ego go for clip kills from over 1km range giving up position for free that is one of the most important factors in this fight. also fixing lav is sometimes very easy unless venom guy do some good spray over wheels, sometimes you fix few and you are good and you can do it faster than venom crashland fix engine and start again
1lav vs 3 venoms? of course easy venom win
3 lav vs 1 venom? easy lav win
3 vs 3? easy lavs win
lavs win more, also finishing lavs after making it disabled need some times unless lav is alone and you can just manual fire him thats a moment when some air support for lav should show up. it is how it is, just lower all ground vehicles prices a little again ( dont forget about bunker limited trader prices ) and its should be fine
viper? for me its almost same threat as every other rocket heli and best counter for it is another rocket heli and not a fucking chukar misha... and 2 sidewinders doesnt matter unless you are lucky, Me and my gunners dont even risk potential problems of wasting them on helis with flares, even using sidewinders in ch/venom swarm is kinda uselles its take sometimes to much time that can be spend shooting with viper gun. As a pilot i find viper way less interesting than every other rocket heli, shit feels like mi rocket... but yeah its fun for gunners
Likes:
Meemeli
Guys guys, how about we just get good at the game
also stop using chat gpt or i will counter fire with it.
yk what I will
@Mishaaa
Why Removing or Nerfing the Venom is a Bad Idea
Why the Venom Isn’t Too Strong
Why Price Changes Aren’t Needed
Why Chukar Restrictions Hurt Balance
Why Removing the Viper is a Mistake
Why Balancing by Removal is Bad Design
also stop using chat gpt or i will counter fire with it.
yk what I will
@Mishaaa
Why Removing or Nerfing the Venom is a Bad Idea
- The Venom is the baseline, not the outlier. Removing it instead of adjusting damage values risks making air combat less diverse. Taking away one of the most iconic helicopters will shrink variety and force everyone into the same 2–3 airframes.
- Ground vehicles already have counters. BMPs, BTRs, and even cheaper AA options can take down Venoms if played correctly. The issue is player positioning and coordination, not the Venom being “unkillable.”
- Crashlanding isn’t an advantage, it’s survival. Every air vehicle in the game can crashland and repair if not finished off. This isn’t unique to the Venom—it’s a mechanic that allows longer engagements instead of instant deaths.
- Removing the Venom shifts balance the wrong way. If only Blackhawk, Chinook, and Littlebird remain, you’re buffing mobility transport roles and nerfing aggressive suppression, which makes infantry and light vehicles overpowered.
Why the Venom Isn’t Too Strong
- Gun power = role fulfillment. The M134 is designed to be a suppression tool. Of course it melts lighter vehicles, but that’s the whole point—it’s not meant to trade evenly with tanks or Linebackers.
- Engine size/hitbox is part of its identity. Smaller engine hitboxes are balanced by lack of flares and weak pilot protection. Pilots get shredded if caught without cover, which is already a risk/reward.
- “Too many HE shots” is misleading. HE is not designed to be an anti-air solution—it’s anti-infantry/light armor. Expecting HE spam to hard-counter Venoms misuses the weapon category.
- Penetration vs. hull: If ground vehicles had full penetration against Venoms, they’d be useless instantly. The partial protection encourages team coordination instead of 1v1ing airframes.
Why Price Changes Aren’t Needed
- Blackhawk already costs a premium for its transport + combat role. Raising it further just discourages its use, leaving only meme-tier or “last resort” helicopters in play.
- Chinook as 1 Briefcase + 15m timer is way too punishing. It’s already a big, weak target that relies on speed + flares. Raising its price turns it into a risk with no reward. People will simply stop using it, removing variety again.
Why Chukar Restrictions Hurt Balance
- Chukars are one of the few skill-based counters to vehicles. Yes, they’re fast, but they’re also fragile and require timing to land a hit. Disallowing them vs. ground vehicles takes away one of the only asymmetric counters that lighter players have against expensive armor.
- Cost is the balancing factor. Even at 20 briefcases, it’s not cheap for new players. A well-positioned tank or armored car can dodge, detect, or counter it. Increasing skill requirement is better than banning usage.
- Vehicles are already powerful. Removing suicide drones lets tanks and IFVs roll unchecked unless someone has heavy AT gear, which isn’t always available.
Why Removing the Viper is a Mistake
- Viper’s strengths = expensive trade-off. It costs a fortune compared to utility helis. If someone invests in a Viper, it should dominate air-to-air. That’s the reward for spending high.
- Sidewinders being strong is intended. Otherwise, why would anyone risk that much gear/briefcases for one heli?
- Teamplay counter exists. Coordinated AA, multiple Chukars, or another attack heli can force it down. Just because it’s hard doesn’t mean it’s broken—it means it fills its role.
- Removing it guts high-tier gameplay. The Viper is the endgame heli. Take it away and all incentive to grind or save for “the big toys” is gone. Players will lose long-term goals.
Why Balancing by Removal is Bad Design
- Knee-jerk removals shrink variety. Taking out the Venom and Viper instead of fine-tuning damage, survivability, or prices will leave the game feeling hollow and repetitive.
- Balance should be additive, not subtractive. Adjusting ammo, armor values, or timers creates healthier counterplay without deleting whole classes of vehicles.
- The real issue is coordination, not stats. Venoms and Vipers feel “OP” because most players don’t coordinate AA support. But that’s a gameplay culture issue, not a balance issue. Nerfing them into the ground won’t suddenly make ground vehicles fun—it’ll just make the skies boring.
biggest problem for ground vehicles are not m134 helis , or helis in general really, except attack helis with 5km radar and lockons. Chukars are really annoying to deal with vehicles that move slow ( everything with tracks) but are definetely possible to be killed with m242 or kpvt. Biggest problem imo are ground to ground lockons from bases, trying to avoid going near bases with lockon threat is nearly impossible with so many bases/group available and javelins being fairly easy to obtain, besides that most ground vehicles wont even warn of the incoming rocket and even the ones that do its really low percentage chance of the smokes to actually working. Once again coming back to the thing im probably most known for #removelockons.